Comments on: The woes of the women’s game http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/ Football in Tasmania Fri, 21 Nov 2008 22:15:14 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.3 By: A whisper http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-4212 A whisper Mon, 14 May 2007 05:13:34 +0000 http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-4212 Hey Dad, can't argue with much of what you said. Hope your little one has better luck. Hey Dad, can’t argue with much of what you said. Hope your little one has better luck.

]]> By: Soccer Dad http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-4209 Soccer Dad Mon, 14 May 2007 03:17:12 +0000 http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-4209 As a player for many decades, and a coach of boys and girls for 15years, ex-club committee member and father of 4 good soccer players, I have read with amusement the comments above. Coaching girls was my biggest challenge, not because of the lack of skill, but because of the lack of support, from all quarters. A prominant Hobart restauranteur who's son's played against my daughter once yelled out to his prodical son "don't let her past you, she's only a girl" Unfortunately, Soccer Tas and others took the same view. I've observed my three elder children playing for years, and have seen the bias in funding and lack of support that leaves women's soccer struggling to develop. I've seen and experienced the politics and crap club attitudes - sat on the bench for nearly a year myself, in Div 4 - after which I retired! Seen my daughter do the same, why? who knows, perhaps she had the audacity to question the coach. She then moved on to a club that cared, but this experience perhaps cost her a place in the national team, who knows. Anyhow, the solution is easy, give more support through chain to females at all levels and make sure your club is not sexist, and the coaching is supportive. From my experience, females are smarter and more mature at any age and respond very differently to men. The guffaw and smash'em attitude just don't work, nor does lambasting female players or benching them 'cause they talk back. You need to better educate your coaches and your clubs to gain respect and retain female players for the future. This talk about busting up Nelson is pure rubbish and is simply an excuse for the long-standing and fundamental failures in the system. My 8 year old is just starting out, full of enthusiasm and promise, but I fear nothing has changed. I hope Nelson is still there in 10 years time. As a player for many decades, and a coach of boys and girls for 15years, ex-club committee member and father of 4 good soccer players, I have read with amusement the comments above. Coaching girls was my biggest challenge, not because of the lack of skill, but because of the lack of support, from all quarters. A prominant Hobart restauranteur who’s son’s played against my daughter once yelled out to his prodical son “don’t let her past you, she’s only a girl” Unfortunately, Soccer Tas and others took the same view. I’ve observed my three elder children playing for years, and have seen the bias in funding and lack of support that leaves women’s soccer struggling to develop. I’ve seen and experienced the politics and crap club attitudes - sat on the bench for nearly a year myself, in Div 4 - after which I retired! Seen my daughter do the same, why? who knows, perhaps she had the audacity to question the coach. She then moved on to a club that cared, but this experience perhaps cost her a place in the national team, who knows. Anyhow, the solution is easy, give more support through chain to females at all levels and make sure your club is not sexist, and the coaching is supportive. From my experience, females are smarter and more mature at any age and respond very differently to men. The guffaw and smash’em attitude just don’t work, nor does lambasting female players or benching them ’cause they talk back. You need to better educate your coaches and your clubs to gain respect and retain female players for the future.

This talk about busting up Nelson is pure rubbish and is simply an excuse for the long-standing and fundamental failures in the system. My 8 year old is just starting out, full of enthusiasm and promise, but I fear nothing has changed. I hope Nelson is still there in 10 years time.

]]> By: A whisper http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-3974 A whisper Thu, 10 May 2007 05:39:39 +0000 http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-3974 Gunka how you solve a problem like this is dependent on what you want to achieve. What are the goals of the game in Tasmania? If the game needs restructuring what is the purpose of that restructure. a. more players playing the game at all levels and both genders? b. a plus a high(er) level of elite talent? c. a plus b plus a healthy club structure? d. a Tasmanian team in a higher league (V or A)? If you are in it for the sport go a to d. If you are in it for other reasons go directly to d...do not pass go.... Gunka how you solve a problem like this is dependent on what you want to achieve. What are the goals of the game in Tasmania? If the game needs restructuring what is the purpose of that restructure.
a. more players playing the game at all levels and both genders?
b. a plus a high(er) level of elite talent?
c. a plus b plus a healthy club structure?
d. a Tasmanian team in a higher league (V or A)?
If you are in it for the sport go a to d. If you are in it for other reasons go directly to d…do not pass go….

]]> By: Soccer Old Girl http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-3964 Soccer Old Girl Thu, 10 May 2007 02:59:30 +0000 http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-3964 On the mainland we have had the same problem in the past where certain teams have dominated but now the others have caught up so in a 12 team league 8 - 10 are competitive. We have a program for young players and they also play premier league, when they were looking for clubs to play with outside the NTC program they were advised that they couldn't all go to the one club so they were spread across numerous clubs...maybe the same should be adopted. But you have to keep in mind that players love playing with their friends. On the mainland we have had the same problem in the past where certain teams have dominated but now the others have caught up so in a 12 team league 8 - 10 are competitive. We have a program for young players and they also play premier league, when they were looking for clubs to play with outside the NTC program they were advised that they couldn’t all go to the one club so they were spread across numerous clubs…maybe the same should be adopted. But you have to keep in mind that players love playing with their friends.

]]> By: gunka http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-3958 gunka Thu, 10 May 2007 01:03:11 +0000 http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-3958 Well stated 'A whisper'. Why is this not being looked into by the top guns in soccer. It seems that everyone else is unhappy and no support is offered. Too many holes in the process of supporting our younger players. Has this happened on the mainland? Has any one in tassie soccer actually sought advice from other leagues? Surely this has happened elsewhere and what initiatives were put in place to help a problem such as this? Well stated ‘A whisper’. Why is this not being looked into by the top guns in soccer. It seems that everyone else is unhappy and no support is offered. Too many holes in the process of supporting our younger players. Has this happened on the mainland? Has any one in tassie soccer actually sought advice from other leagues?
Surely this has happened elsewhere and what initiatives were put in place to help a problem such as this?

]]> By: A whisper http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-3947 A whisper Wed, 09 May 2007 22:26:01 +0000 http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-3947 Right you are Abramovich...no faith at all. Every time we get a change at the top we are promised something different. The current hierachy will tell you the game is growing so they must be doing something right. What is right is that you have a number of clubs now instead of two adopting the grow-your-own-juniors principal...developing their own club structures etc. South, Kingborough, Metro, Clarence are all into this and Nelson, because of thier club structure and personnel have developed a good 'feel'about their club. Some of the others will catch up but FFT have done NOTHING to assist this process. In fact, by putting state rep teams into the competitions, they are undermining it for the uncertain claim that they will produce better elite players. What they fail to understand is that the elite success is only the product of all the other hard work. To paraphrase golfer Gary Player ...The harder I practice the luckier I seem to get. The same applies here. If FFT will help the clubs to do the groundwork the results will come at the elite end. Unfortunately there are also a number of women playing in Division One that should be playing Premier League but if the will is not there not much can be done. Right you are Abramovich…no faith at all. Every time we get a change at the top we are promised something different. The current hierachy will tell you the game is growing so they must be doing something right. What is right is that you have a number of clubs now instead of two adopting the grow-your-own-juniors principal…developing their own club structures etc. South, Kingborough, Metro, Clarence are all into this and Nelson, because of thier club structure and personnel have developed a good ‘feel’about their club. Some of the others will catch up but FFT have done NOTHING to assist this process. In fact, by putting state rep teams into the competitions, they are undermining it for the uncertain claim that they will produce better elite players. What they fail to understand is that the elite success is only the product of all the other hard work. To paraphrase golfer Gary Player …The harder I practice the luckier I seem to get. The same applies here. If FFT will help the clubs to do the groundwork the results will come at the elite end.
Unfortunately there are also a number of women playing in Division One that should be playing Premier League but if the will is not there not much can be done.

]]> By: Blackjack http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-3941 Blackjack Wed, 09 May 2007 13:03:58 +0000 http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-3941 7-0 huh?? Wasn't that match 1 v 2? Sorry, that's not funny. These types of scores will see New Town Eagles requesting not to play in Premier League next season too. I am NOT having a shot at Nelson here I'm merely stating a horrible fact. Some women will find this a turn off and cause questions to be asked. Questions such as, "Why bother". By the same token, how are Nelson going to motivate themselves to play at the top of their game when they can achieve score such as this against the second best team in Southern Tasmania?? Goal differences are just ridiculous (played 6 games): 1. Nelson - For 56; Against 3 2. Eagles - For 33; Against 8 5. Knights - For 5; Against 50 (they have won one game) 7. Clarence - For 0; Against 35 There are still 12 full rounds to play. What does this teach anyone (winners or loosers)? 7-0 huh?? Wasn’t that match 1 v 2?

Sorry, that’s not funny. These types of scores will see New Town Eagles requesting not to play in Premier League next season too.

I am NOT having a shot at Nelson here I’m merely stating a horrible fact.

Some women will find this a turn off and cause questions to be asked. Questions such as, “Why bother”. By the same token, how are Nelson going to motivate themselves to play at the top of their game when they can achieve score such as this against the second best team in Southern Tasmania??

Goal differences are just ridiculous (played 6 games):

1. Nelson - For 56; Against 3
2. Eagles - For 33; Against 8

5. Knights - For 5; Against 50 (they have won one game)

7. Clarence - For 0; Against 35

There are still 12 full rounds to play.

What does this teach anyone (winners or loosers)?

]]> By: sj http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-3939 sj Wed, 09 May 2007 12:29:06 +0000 http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-3939 South Hobart 1 Zebras 0 Nelson 7 Eagles 0 South Hobart 1 Zebras 0
Nelson 7 Eagles 0

]]> By: gunka http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-3929 gunka Wed, 09 May 2007 07:16:12 +0000 http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-3929 Well said Blackjack, yes the teams need to hang on to their players and we need ideas of how to do this. I would like to point out the wonderful job people such as Anne Jarvis and Tony Chaffey do in the Junior ranks (these are only a couple of the many). The northern suburbs, Central and Eastern Regions all work hard with their players and clubs and the amount of talent amongst the Regionals/clubs is amazing. Perhaps this is an area to be looked at in the sense of recruiting. Is there a programme in place (besides state teams) to encourage players to play for the women's league? (I don't know that's why I'm asking), or do clubs actually make themselves known to junior clubs to encourage players to go forward? Also maybe the cost of playing is intimidating. A junior fees are approx $55-80, however when you reach the women's league it becomes approx $240 plus, now that's a huge difference. Could this also be a factor? I don't begrudge paying to compete in your sport and I know that this money is used in essential areas in soccer, but could this be a problem driving players to leave? Maybe a survey of the clubs, coaches and players should be conducted asking detailed questions (anon) of why they feel their club is successful or what areas could be improved in their personal opinion etc. Clubs like Nelson could give their input and others could learn or adapt some simple strategies. This should be done perhaps by the women's body and then a detailed report with advice on all areas (not just playing) could be given to all clubs for some ideas. I think some unity from all clubs is sometimes needed to make a sport successful and any ideas should be presented to offer a solution. Maybe a survey is not the answer but something is needed to help. Another area is do we give all teams the opportunity to have a specialised coach come in from the assoc and give ideas? This could be done on a training night. This is not to say that coaches currently aren't doing a wonderful job, as I'm sure they are, but sometimes a little insight into soccer from someone who's been coaching for 20 years could help in some way. It is so hard to find coaches in the first place and this suggestion is in no way to offend but to offer alternatives. I applaud any one who is willing to put their hand up to coach as it is a hard job. After saying all this, sometimes "time" is needed to nuture players and to establish highly competitive teams. I don't know of many clubs or teams who have won many games straight up. Maybe some ideas I've written may help, who knows, but any suggestion is better than no suggestion??? Well said Blackjack, yes the teams need to hang on to their players and we need ideas of how to do this. I would like to point out the wonderful job people such as Anne Jarvis and Tony Chaffey do in the Junior ranks (these are only a couple of the many). The northern suburbs, Central and Eastern Regions all work hard with their players and clubs and the amount of talent amongst the Regionals/clubs is amazing. Perhaps this is an area to be looked at in the sense of recruiting. Is there a programme in place (besides state teams) to encourage players to play for the women’s league? (I don’t know that’s why I’m asking), or do clubs actually make themselves known to junior clubs to encourage players to go forward?
Also maybe the cost of playing is intimidating. A junior fees are approx $55-80, however when you reach the women’s league it becomes approx $240 plus, now that’s a huge difference. Could this also be a factor? I don’t begrudge paying to compete in your sport and I know that this money is used in essential areas in soccer, but could this be a problem driving players to leave?
Maybe a survey of the clubs, coaches and players should be conducted asking detailed questions (anon) of why they feel their club is successful or what areas could be improved in their personal opinion etc. Clubs like Nelson could give their input and others could learn or adapt some simple strategies. This should be done perhaps by the women’s body and then a detailed report with advice on all areas (not just playing) could be given to all clubs for some ideas. I think some unity from all clubs is sometimes needed to make a sport successful and any ideas should be presented to offer a solution. Maybe a survey is not the answer but something is needed to help.
Another area is do we give all teams the opportunity to have a specialised coach come in from the assoc and give ideas? This could be done on a training night. This is not to say that coaches currently aren’t doing a wonderful job, as I’m sure they are, but sometimes a little insight into soccer from someone who’s been coaching for 20 years could help in some way. It is so hard to find coaches in the first place and this suggestion is in no way to offend but to offer alternatives. I applaud any one who is willing to put their hand up to coach as it is a hard job.
After saying all this, sometimes “time” is needed to nuture players and to establish highly competitive teams. I don’t know of many clubs or teams who have won many games straight up.
Maybe some ideas I’ve written may help, who knows, but any suggestion is better than no suggestion???

]]> By: Blackjack http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-3925 Blackjack Wed, 09 May 2007 06:39:00 +0000 http://tasfootball.plebian.net/blog/20070426/the-woes-of-the-womens-game/#comment-3925 Abramovich, it depends on who you talk to to ascertain what the solution s are to the wome's game. If you talk to the ones that are currently doing ok, there is no problem and it's only the whingers who think there is a problem. But if you talk to the grass roots players (those struggling to string a win or two together) girls are leaving the game to quickly or trying to find motivation to continue to play. The current FFT programme of taking promising players and putting them in a rep squad doesn't help matters very much. Why can't the rep players be permitted to play for their clubs of a weekend but be released mid week for rep duty. It would help to spread the talent at least. The other aspect that must be considered is the rep pool allows the current U17 coach open slather to 'influence' players to stay together after the rep programme is finished. FFT do really need to take a long hard look at the current female game. I spoke to another lady today who claims her daughter has recently quit the game to go and play rugby as she is tired and demoralised by frequent 'thrashings'. Abramovich, it depends on who you talk to to ascertain what the solution s are to the wome’s game. If you talk to the ones that are currently doing ok, there is no problem and it’s only the whingers who think there is a problem. But if you talk to the grass roots players (those struggling to string a win or two together) girls are leaving the game to quickly or trying to find motivation to continue to play.

The current FFT programme of taking promising players and putting them in a rep squad doesn’t help matters very much. Why can’t the rep players be permitted to play for their clubs of a weekend but be released mid week for rep duty. It would help to spread the talent at least. The other aspect that must be considered is the rep pool allows the current U17 coach open slather to ‘influence’ players to stay together after the rep programme is finished.

FFT do really need to take a long hard look at the current female game. I spoke to another lady today who claims her daughter has recently quit the game to go and play rugby as she is tired and demoralised by frequent ‘thrashings’.

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